Talk:Upper East Side

listgaps

per WP:LISTGAP, we should try to fix the lists which are being broken apart using {{col-break}}. I attempted to fix this but was reverted with no explanation. Frietjes (talk) 13:18, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

I reverted as the columns you made were too far apart, making them visually difficult for the reader. LISTGAP is extremely overrated, in factm primarily a solution in search of a problem. Screen readers are the real problem, not markup. Beyond My Ken (talk) 23:09, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

BMK, we've been thru this before and several people (@Izno, Graham87, Redrose64, and Jonesey95:) have said the same thing. LISTGAP is important to those with screen readers and it is not overrated to them. Markup, not screen readers is the problem. Screen readers are doing exactly what the markup tells it. Try not to use fix-width columns, such as {{col-begin}} or {{reflist|2}}. They may look fine on your computer, but those using mobile phones or tables would say otherwise. Bgwhite (talk) 18:54, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

Indeed, thanks Bgwhite. I wouldn't have gone around for almost the last nine years fixing LISTGAP problems if I thought they were overrated. Graham87 03:44, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

BMK, if you think that there is a LISTGAP-related problem in one or more screen-reading software programs, I urge you to file a bug against it. In the meantime, LISTGAP problems will continue to be fixed by Graham87 (check out this feature on him in the latest Signpost) and other editors who know that accessibility is critical to creating a modern encyclopedia. – Jonesey95 (talk) 05:27, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

The issue of too far apart can be fixed by editing the provided starting template, regardless of listgap. --Izno (talk) 20:49, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

Use the |colwidth= parameter with {{colbegin}}. Generally, adjust its value so that it is wide enough to accommodate the longest list entry without wrapping; but this may not be possible for very long entries like Andrew Carnegie Mansion and those others that have extra text.

Some of the images are on the large side; in general, there is no need for a forced image size - it's normally best to use the default image size, see MOS:IMAGES#Size and WP:IMGSIZE. If the size parameter is removed from these images - or altered to a plain |upright - more space will be available for the columns. Connected with that, three of the overlarge images depict museums - yet are placed at the bottom of Upper East Side#Politics; this itself is an accessibility issue, since the images relate to the section Upper East Side#Museums, but are not inside that section. See WP:ACCIM item 5, and MOS:IMAGELOCATION#Vertical placement. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 23:41, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

@Izno, Jonesey95, Graham87, Bgwhite, Beyond My Ken, Frietjes, and Redrose64: You may find something useful in Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Accessibility § Listgap: a proposal. It is not directly related to lists in tables, but is about listgaps in lists anywhere. --Thnidu (talk) 06:34, 1 February 2017 (UTC)

"New York" vs. "New York State"

@Beyond My Ken: Yes, I see that my edit didn't have the effect I wanted. Thank you for reverting it.

What was bothering me was

• Show map of Manhattan
• Show map of New York City
• Show map of New York
• Show map of the US
• Show all

To me at least, the default interpretation of "New York" is not the state but the city, which is far better known worldwide. Even though the city is explicitly named right above the supposedly implicit naming of the state, I was trying to make it explicit, but I didn't do it right. In fact, I can't figure out either how to do it, or what, if anything, my edit actually did. Do you know either answer?

--Thnidu (talk) 00:33, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

I absolutely agree that the default interpretation of "New York" is the city, and that disambiguation to "New York State" is therefore often necessary, but when "New York" follows "New York City", I think it is abundantly clear what "New York" is referring to, as the city has already been presented as a option beforehand.

Aside: Back in the late 60s or early 70s, Norman Mailer ran for mayor of New York City, with Jimmy Breslin as his running mate. Part of their platform was that New York City should become a separate state -- indeed the local PBS station had a public affairs program around that time called "The 51st State". Of course, it never happened, but given politics in the state, where the legislature is dominated by upstate elements, I often wish it had. I was musing the other day about what New York City would be called if it was its own state. "Gotham" is the obvious choice, but that has now been permanently taken over by Batman and Co. Finally, I decided that if we can have a North Dakota and a South Dakota, a North Carolina and a South Carolina, and a Virginia and a West Virginia, all differentiated by a single word, we could have the states of New York and New York City at the same time. All fantasy, of course, the state would never let us secede -- they wouldn't even let Staten Island secede from the city (and I was all in favor of giving it to New Jersey, especially now that we don't need their landfill for our garbage). Beyond My Ken (talk) 01:32, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

The official name of the state term used on the state's official website is New York State, not simply New York. Labeling it as such would avoid the awkward and potentially ambiguous "Show map of New York City/Show map of New York". Even if most readers can be trusted to figure out the intended meaning of New York from the context, an extra disambiguating term certainly wouldn't hurt anything. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 14:36, 28 March 2017 (UTC) (updated 23:11, 29 March 2017 (UTC))

Actually, the official name of the state is the "State of New York", so your suggestion is moot. Beyond My Ken (talk) 03:19, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

I've clarified my wording. The point is that the map legend should be clear to readers. New York State makes the city/state distinction clear. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 23:11, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

Well, sure, it could say "New York State", but since an earlier choice was "New York City", why would it be necessary? Certainly there aren't going to be two choices of NYC maps, right? So the "New York" which follows "New York City" must be the state. In any case, the question should not be addressed here, but on the talk page for the infobox template, or wherever that listing is generated, which is not locally. Beyond My Ken (talk) 02:03, 30 March 2017 (UTC) Beyond My Ken (talk) 02:03, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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" Traditionally, the Upper East Side has been dominated by wealthy White Anglo-Saxon Protestant families"

When? 100 years ago? This is clearly not the case anymore, so why include this statement in the modern demographics section? It should be in the history section, if anything.Jonathan f1 (talk) 09:37, 15 June 2019 (UTC)

Right here and now. There's a reason it's called the "Silk Stocking District". Beyond My Ken (talk) 23:25, 7 September 2019 (UTC)

Education / Colleges: Use current rather than archived?

Why are archived (wayback machine) locations used rather than the actual current locations?

Example: The New York School of Interior Design references <https://web.archive.org/web/20160523045328/http://www.nysid.edu/student-life/facilities> rather than <https://www.nysid.edu/facilities>?

Gprobins (talk) 13:36, 7 September 2019 (UTC)

WP:SOFIXIT. Beyond My Ken (talk) 23:23, 7 September 2019 (UTC)

Notable people

I think this section should be split to List of people from the Upper East Side. The section is already pretty long (it makes up 218 of the 327 references) and has more than 83,000 of this page's 156,000 characters of wikicode. epicgenius (talk) 17:57, 14 December 2019 (UTC)

I have now split this after three months with no objections. epicgenius (talk) 00:40, 27 March 2020 (UTC)

NYC's Currently Most Expensive Neighborhood (for ASU)

I would like to make the edit describing NYC's most expensive neighborhood. It is now Hudson Yards rather than the Upper East Side. I am new to Wikipedia editing, as this is required for an assignment.

Source: https://www.amny.com/real-estate/most-expensive-manhattan-neighborhoods-2024/#:~:text=Hudson%20Yards%20clocked%20in%20as,2023%20to%2024%20in%202024. Adamico4 (talk) 16:56, 22 April 2025 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Canada's Response to Global Environmental Wicked Problems

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation–supported course assignment, between 15 January 2025 and 7 May 2025. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Nwu04 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Nwu04 (talk) 08:16, 7 May 2025 (UTC)