Talk:Narrow Water Castle

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Is Narrow Water Castle a Water castle, meaning: Is it surrounded by water-ditches or is it just at the bank of the river and the other 3 sides are not protected by water? In the latter case I will take Narrow Water Castle out of the article Water castle. Those of you, who have seen the castle: Please answer. --Rheinländer 09:48, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

It's a castle at the Narrow Water of Carlingford Lough, as I understand it. There's also a tower on the opposite shore of the narrows, to control passage in the lough. Certainly when I visited, Narrow Water Castle was at the side of the lough-side road, between the road and the shore of the lough. I walked round the exterior landside wall - it was not moated (but whether it may have been moated in the past, I don't know). Man vyi 13:56, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you, Man vyi! The Castle is not a typical water castle, so I will take it out of the article water castle. There is Motte on the map only a few hundred meters away from the castle. --Rheinländer 10:15, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Narrow Water Keep

This whole page is completely inaccurate. This article is about 'Narrow water Keep'. Narrow water castle is actually a different building on the other side of the dual carriageway, the current residence of the Hall family which hosts music concerts, art shows and horse riding competitions. Please ammend. fabnt (talk) 08:24, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

Requested move 28 May 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved. The presented evidence seems to suggest common name is the "castle" version  — Amakuru (talk) 13:32, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

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Narrow Water Castle → Narrow Water Keep, Warrenpoint – Narrow Water Castle is a completely different site. This article is clearly about the building known as the Narrow Water Keep Lisburn lovely (talk) 18:43, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

Further evidence

• Google search: Narrow Water Castle: About 799,000 results
• Google search: Narrow Water Keep: About 2,970,000 results

As per WP:COMMONNAME it should be renamed.

• Oppose. "Narrow Water Keep" returns only 9 hits on Google Books, compared to 1680 for "Narrow Water Castle". The current name appears to be the WP:COMMONNNAME.--Cúchullain ^t/c 18:07, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

• Comment: The other "Narrow Water Castle" is a 19th Century stately home that now offers tourist accomodation, see Warrenpoint#Places of interest. It's probably not notable, so the question is simply which is the common name for the older building. Andrewa (talk) 08:39, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

• As a local to the area I can assure you the building this article is about is "Narrow Water Keep". Narrow Water Castle is 400 meters up hill from this point - an early 19th Century stately home. it replaced the 16th century Mount Hall part of which survives. I myself use part of the stables of Mount Hall for business storage.

  Books of local History and books of local folklore mention and discuss the keep, and allways differentiate between this defensive keep and surrounding castles and stately homes.

  This article should definately be renamed. ~2026-44321-15 (talk) 10:38, 12 August 2026 (UTC)

"Narrow Water Castle" (medieval keep/tower house) and "Narrow Water Castle" (later mansion house)

A number of Talk page contributors have noted that there are two structures called "Narrow Water Castle". And that this title is "completely inaccurate" and should be moved/renamed.

The first thing I would note is that there are/were, technically, three structures called "Narrow Water Castle": The original 13th century Norman keep, the later 16th century tower house and bawn, and the 19th century mansion house. All known as "Narrow Water Castle".

The second thing I would point out is that the 16th tower house and bawn (at the water's edge) isn't, technically a "keep". And the later 19th century manor house isn't, technically, a "castle".

The main thing to note here is that this situation (that the original medieval tower house and the later replacement manor house share the same name) is far from unique. It could even be described as pretty common. Between the 15th and 17th centuries, many hundreds of tower houses were built across Ireland. Most acting as the (fortified) mansion/estate house for those who owned the surrounding lands/demesne. In the 18th and 19th centuries, when defence was less important and comfort was a factor (for the well-to-do families who owned these old/cold/wet/draughty/small tower houses), the owners of these estates/demesnes often built new estate houses. To act as the "main house" for the estate. This new house very typically retained the name of the original castle/demesne. (While there are dozens and dozens of these, I'd point to Ballynahinch Castle, Cabra Castle, Castlehyde, Crom Castle, Dunboy Castle, Glin Castle, as examples. It's really only when the original "castle" had independent notability/fame, like Blarney Castle, that the newer house, like Blarney House, took a different name....)

In terms of a "solution", I don't support renaming/moving this article. I think the best thing to do is to expand the scope of this article to cover the medieval tower house (commonly known as Narrow Water Castle) as well as the later mansion house (also known as Narrow Water Castle). This would be consistent with how this "situation" is addressed in umpteen other articles. Including those above. (Even the Blarney Castle article covers the later/replacement estate house within the same article....) Guliolopez (talk) 15:29, 12 August 2026 (UTC)

Bump. Unless there are other thoughts on an approach, I will move ahead with the changes proposed above shortly. (To reframe this title slightly, in keeping with other similar titles, to more clearly cover and distinguish the two buildings known as "Narrow Water Castle"....) Guliolopez (talk) 15:08, 20 August 2026 (UTC)

OK. Having left this for nearly 3 weeks, and not having heard any other thoughts, I've gone as proposed. In short, I've updated the lead (to "move up" mention of the 19th-century mansion and include the "Narrow Water Keep" name - with an "r from alt name" redirect). I also expanded the body text and added an additional section to more clearly distinguish the two "castles" (of the same name and on the same estate/demesne). I've also added an image of the 19th-century house. (FWIW, when looking for examples on Commons, I noted that almost all images of the 19th-century house refer to it as "Narrow Water Manor House", while many images of the 16th-century tower house refer to it as "Narrow Water Castle". But anyway.... ) Guliolopez (talk) 14:54, 7 September 2026 (UTC)