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Latest comment: 2 days ago by Zaathras in topic Controversial Page
Former good article nomineeDonald Trump was a Social sciences and society good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
June 2, 2006Good article nomineeNot listed
February 12, 2007Good article nomineeNot listed
September 17, 2016Good article nomineeNot listed
May 25, 2017Good article nomineeNot listed
December 2, 2018Good article nomineeNot listed
July 15, 2019Good article nomineeNot listed
August 31, 2019Featured article candidateNot promoted
April 29, 2020Peer reviewReviewed
Current status: Former good article nominee

Current consensus

[edit]

NOTE: It is recommended to link to this list in your edit summary when reverting, as:
[[Talk:Donald Trump#Cn|consensus n]], replacing both occurrences of n with the item number.
To ensure you are viewing the current list, you may wish to purge this page.

1. Use the official White House portrait as the infobox image. (Dec 2016, Jan 2017, Oct 2017, March 2020) (temporarily suspended by #19 following copyright issues on the inauguration portrait, enforced when an official public-domain portrait was released on 31 October 2017)

2. Show birthplace as "Queens, New York City, U.S." in the infobox. (Nov 2016, Oct 2018, Feb 2021) "New York City" de-linked. (September 2020)

3. Omit reference to county-level election statistics. (Dec 2016)

4. Superseded by #15
Lead phrasing of Trump "gaining a majority of the U.S. Electoral College" and "receiving a smaller share of the popular vote nationwide", without quoting numbers. (Nov 2016, Dec 2016) (Superseded by #15 since 11 February 2017)

5. Use Trump's annual net worth evaluation and matching ranking, from the Forbes list of billionaires, not from monthly or "live" estimates. (Oct 2016) In the lead section, just write: Forbes estimates his net worth to be [$x.x] billion. (July 2018, July 2018) Removed from the lead per #47.

6. Do not include allegations of sexual misconduct in the lead section. (June 2016, Feb 2018)

7. Superseded by #35
Include "Many of his public statements were controversial or false." in the lead. (Sep 2016, February 2017, wording shortened per April 2017, upheld with July 2018) (superseded by #35 since 18 February 2019)
8. Superseded by unlisted consensus
Mention that Trump is the first president elected "without prior military or government service". (Dec 2016, superseded Nov 2024)

9. Include a link to Trump's Twitter account in the "External links" section. (Jan 2017) Include a link to an archive of Trump's Twitter account in the "External links" section. (Jan 2021)

10. Canceled
Keep Barron Trump's name in the list of children and wikilink it, which redirects to his section in Family of Donald Trump per AfD consensus. (Jan 2017, Nov 2016) Canceled: Barron's BLP has existed since June 2019. (June 2024)
11. Superseded by #17
The lead sentence is "Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is an American businessman, television personality, politician, and the 45th President of the United States." (Jan 2017, Jan 2017, Jan 2017, Jan 2017, Jan 2017, Feb 2017) (superseded by #17 since 2 April 2017)

12. The article title is Donald Trump, not Donald J. Trump. (RM Jan 2017, RM June 2019)

13. Auto-archival is set for discussions with no comments for 7 days. Manual archival is allowed for (1) closed discussions, 24 hours after the closure, provided the closure has not been challenged, and (2) "answered" edit requests, 24 hours after the "answer", provided there has been no follow-on discussion after the "answer". (Jan 2017) (amended with respect to manual archiving, to better reflect common practice at this article) (Nov 2019) Strikethrough per #74.

14. Omit mention of Trump's alleged bathmophobia/fear of slopes. (Feb 2017)

15. Superseded by lead rewrite
Supersedes #4. There is no consensus to change the formulation of the paragraph which summarizes election results in the lead (starting with "Trump won the general election on November 8, 2016, …"). Accordingly the pre-RfC text (Diff 8 Jan 2017) has been restored, with minor adjustments to past tense (Diff 11 Feb 2018). No new changes should be applied without debate. (RfC Feb 2017, Jan 2017, Feb 2017, Feb 2017) In particular, there is no consensus to include any wording akin to "losing the popular vote". (RfC March 2017) (Superseded by local consensus on 26 May 2017 and lead section rewrite on 23 June 2017)
16. Superseded by lead rewrite
Do not mention Russian influence on the presidential election in the lead section. (RfC March 2017) (Superseded by lead section rewrite on 23 June 2017)
17. Superseded by #50
Supersedes #11. The lead paragraph is "Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current president of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality." The hatnote is simply {{Other uses}}. (April 2017, RfC April 2017, April 2017, April 2017, April 2017, July 2017, Dec 2018) Amended by lead section rewrite on 23 June 2017 and removal of inauguration date on 4 July 2018. Lower-case "p" in "president" per Dec 2018 and MOS:JOBTITLES RfC Oct 2017. Wikilinks modified per April 2020. Wikilink modified again per July 2020. "45th" de-linked. (Jan 2021)
18. Superseded by #63
The "Alma mater" infobox entry shows "Wharton School (BS Econ.)", does not mention Fordham University. (April 2017, April 2017, Aug 2020, Dec 2020)
19. Obsolete
Following deletion of Trump's official White House portrait for copyright reasons on 2 June 2017, infobox image was replaced by File:Donald Trump Pentagon 2017.jpg. (June 2017 for replacement, June 2017, declined REFUND on 11 June 2017) (replaced by White House official public-domain portrait according to #1 since 31 Oct 2017)
20. Superseded by unlisted consensus
Mention protests in the lead section with this exact wording: His election and policies have sparked numerous protests. (June 2017, May 2018, superseded December 2024) (Note: In February 2021, when he was no longer president, the verb tense was changed from "have sparked" to "sparked", without objection.)
21. Superseded by #39
Omit any opinions about Trump's psychology held by mental health academics or professionals who have not examined him. (July 2017, Aug 2017) (superseded by #36 on 18 June 2019, then by #39 since 20 Aug 2019)

22. Do not call Trump a "liar" in Wikipedia's voice. Falsehoods he uttered can be mentioned, while being mindful of calling them "lies", which implies malicious intent. (RfC Aug 2017, upheld by RfC July 2024)

23. Superseded by #52
The lead includes the following sentence: Trump ordered a travel ban on citizens from several Muslim-majority countries, citing security concerns; after legal challenges, the Supreme Court upheld the policy's third revision. (Aug 2017, Nov 2017, Dec 2017, Jan 2018, Jan 2018) Wording updated (July 2018) and again (Sep 2018).
24. Superseded by #30
Do not include allegations of racism in the lead. (Feb 2018)

25. In citations, do not code the archive-related parameters for sources that are not dead. (Dec 2017, March 2018)

26. Do not include opinions by Michael Hayden and Michael Morell that Trump is a "useful fool […] manipulated by Moscow" or an "unwitting agent of the Russian Federation". (RfC April 2018)

27. State that Trump falsely claimed that Hillary Clinton started the Barack Obama birther rumors. (April 2018, June 2018)

28. Include, in the Wealth section, a sentence on Jonathan Greenberg's allegation that Trump deceived him in order to get on the Forbes 400 list. (June 2018, June 2018)

29. Include material about the Trump administration family separation policy in the article. (June 2018)

30. Supersedes #24. The lead includes: "Many of his comments and actions have been characterized as racially charged or racist." (RfC Sep 2018, Oct 2018, RfC May 2019). Consensus on "racially charged" descriptor later superseded (February 2025).

31. Do not mention Trump's office space donation to Jesse Jackson's Rainbow/Push Coalition in 1999. (Nov 2018)

32. Omit from the lead the fact that Trump is the first sitting U.S. president to meet with a North Korean supreme leader. See #44. (RfC July 2018, Nov 2018)

33. Do not mention "birtherism" in the lead section. (RfC Nov 2018)

34. Refer to Ivana Zelníčková as a Czech model, with a link to Czechs (people), not Czechoslovakia (country). (Jan 2019)

35. Superseded by #49
Supersedes #7. Include in the lead: Trump has made many false or misleading statements during his campaign and presidency. The statements have been documented by fact-checkers, and the media have widely described the phenomenon as unprecedented in American politics. (RfC Feb 2019)
36. Superseded by #39
Include one paragraph merged from Health of Donald Trump describing views about Trump's psychology expressed by public figures, media sources, and mental health professionals who have not examined him. (June 2019) (paragraph removed per RfC Aug 2019 yielding consensus #39)

37. Resolved: Content related to Trump's presidency should be limited to summary-level about things that are likely to have a lasting impact on his life and/or long-term presidential legacy. (June 2019)

38. Do not state in the lead that Trump is the wealthiest U.S. president ever. (RfC June 2019)

39. Supersedes #21 and #36. Do not include any paragraph regarding Trump's mental health or mental fitness for office. Do not bring up for discussion again until an announced formal diagnosis or WP:MEDRS-level sources are provided. This does not preclude bringing up for discussion whether to include media coverage relating to Trump's mental health and fitness. This does not prevent inclusion of content about temperamental fitness for office. (RfC Aug 2019, July 2021)

40. Include, when discussing Trump's exercise or the lack thereof: He has called golfing his "primary form of exercise", although he usually does not walk the course. He considers exercise a waste of energy, because he believes the body is "like a battery, with a finite amount of energy" which is depleted by exercise. (RfC Aug 2019)

41. Omit book authorship (or lack thereof) from the lead section. (RfC Nov 2019)

42. House and Senate outcomes of the impeachment process are separated by a full stop. For example: He was impeached by the House on December 18, 2019, for abuse of power and obstruction of Congress. He was acquitted of both charges by the Senate on February 5, 2020. (Feb 2020)

43. The rules for edits to the lead are no different from those for edits below the lead. For edits that do not conflict with existing consensus: Prior consensus is NOT required. BOLD edits are allowed, subject to normal BRD process. The mere fact that an edit has not been discussed is not a valid reason to revert it. (March 2020)

44. Superseded by #71
The lead section should mention North Korea, focusing on Trump's meetings with Kim and some degree of clarification that they haven't produced clear results. See #32. (RfC May 2020)
45. Superseded by #48
There is no consensus to mention the COVID-19 pandemic in the lead section. (RfC May 2020, July 2020)

46. Use the caption "Official portrait, 2017" for the infobox image. (Aug 2020, Jan 2021) The consensus carries forward to "Official portrait, 2025" in 2025.

47. Do not mention Trump's net worth or Forbes ranking (or equivalents from other publications) in the lead, nor in the infobox. (Sep 2020)

48. Supersedes #45. Trump's reaction to the COVID-19 pandemic should be mentioned in the lead section. There is no consensus on specific wording, but the status quo is Trump reacted slowly to the COVID-19 pandemic; he minimized the threat, ignored or contradicted many recommendations from health officials, and promoted false information about unproven treatments and the availability of testing. (Oct 2020, RfC Aug 2020)

49. Supersedes #35. Include in lead: Trump has made many false and misleading statements during his campaigns and presidency, to a degree unprecedented in American politics. (Dec 2020)

50. Superseded by #70
Supersedes #17. The lead sentence is: Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is an American politician, media personality, and businessman who served as the 45th president of the United States from 2017 to 2021. (March 2021), amended (July 2021), inclusion of politician (RfC September 2021)

51. Include in the lead that many of Trump's comments and actions have been characterized as misogynistic. (Aug 2021 and Sep 2021)

52. Supersedes #23. The lead should contain a summary of Trump's actions on immigration, including the Muslim travel ban (cf. item 23), the wall, and the family separation policy. (September 2021)

53. The lead should mention that Trump promotes conspiracy theories. (RfC October 2021)

54. Include in the lead that, quote, Scholars and historians rank Trump as one of the worst presidents in U.S. history. (RfC October 2021) Amended after re-election: After his first term, scholars and historians ranked Trump as one of the worst presidents in American history. (November 2024)

55. Regarding Trump's comments on the 2017 far-right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, do not wiki-link "Trump's comments" in this manner. (RfC December 2021)

56. Retain the content that Trump never confronted Putin over its alleged bounties against American soldiers in Afghanistan but add context. Current wording can be altered or contextualized; no consensus was achieved on alternate wordings. (RfC November 2021) Trump's expressions of doubt regarding the Russian Bounties Program should be included in some capacity, though there there is no consensus on a specific way to characterize these expressed doubts. (RfC March 2022)

57. Do not mention in the lead Gallup polling that states Trump's the only president to never reach 50% approval rating. (RfC January 2022)

58. Use inline citations in the lead for the more contentious and controversial statements. Editors should further discuss which sentences would benefit from having inline citations. (RfC May 2022, discussion on what to cite May 2022)

59. Do not label or categorize Trump as a far-right politician. (RfC August 2022)

60. Insert the links described in the RfC January 2023.

61. When a thread is started with a general assertion that the article is biased for or against Trump (i.e., without a specific, policy-based suggestion for a change to the article), it is to be handled as follows:

  1. Reply briefly with a link to Talk:Donald Trump/Response to claims of bias, optionally using its shortcut, WP:TRUMPRCB.
  2. Close the thread using {{archive top}} and {{archive bottom}}, referring to this consensus item. Suggested closure for copy-and-paste:
    {{atop|Please read [[WP:TRUMPRCB]]. Closing per [[Talk:Donald Trump#C61|consensus 61]]. Eligible for manual archival after this time tomorrow. ~~~~}}
    [existing thread]
    {{abot}}
  3. Wait at least 24 hours per #13.
  4. Manually archive the thread.

This does not apply to posts that are clearly in bad faith, which are to be removed on sight. (May 2023)

62. The article's description of the five people who died during and subsequent to the January 6 Capitol attack should avoid a) mentioning the causes of death and b) an explicit mention of the Capitol Police Officer who died. (RfC July 2023)

63. Supersedes #18. The alma mater field of the infobox reads: "University of Pennsylvania (BS)". (September 2023)

64. Omit the {{Very long}} tag. (January 2024)

65. Mention the Abraham Accords in the article; no consensus was achieved on specific wordings. (RfC February 2024)

66. Omit {{infobox criminal}}. (RfC June 2024)

67. The "Health" section includes: "Trump says he has never drunk alcohol, smoked cigarettes, or used drugs. He drugs, and that he sleeps about four or five hours a night." (February 2021) Amended (October 2025)

68. Do not expand the brief mention of Trumpism in the lead. (RfC January 2025)

69. Do not include the word "criminal" in the first sentence. (January 2025)

70. Supersedes #50. First two sentences read:

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is an American politician, media personality, and businessman who is the 47th president of the United States. A member of the Republican Party, he served as the 45th president from 2017 to 2021.

Linking exactly as shown. (February 2025)

71. Supersedes #44. Omit from the lead a mention of the Trump–Kim meetings of 2018 and 2019. (April 2025)

72. Omit from the lead a mention of the January 6 pardons. (RfC July 2025)

73. Article body includes:

Trump had a 15-year friendship with Jeffrey Epstein; persons who knew them at the time said they frequently hit on and competed for women. Media attention and public pressure mounted in 2025, when his administration did not release files relating to Epstein, despite Trump's promise to do so during the 2024 campaign.

(August 2025, September 2025)

74. This article adheres to WP:EDITREQ. If an edit request is potentially controversial, an editor responds in one of three ways:

  • :{{subst:EEp|c}} ~~~~, rendering as:
     Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit extended-protected}} template. [your signature]
  • If the editor prefers a less formal, more personal touch, non-template language to the same effect as above.
  • Or some combination of the above two, with the template first.
    Unless someone feels the response was incorrect for the situation (the edit request was not potentially controversial), no comments are posted after the response. Unless there is a good faith challenge in the interim, the thread is manually archived after 24 hours after the response, per #13. (October 2025)

75. Mention the Greenland crisis in the body. (January 2026)

76. Do not use the word "persecution" when describing Trump's policies toward transgender people. See closure for more. (RfC May 2026)

Internal consistency

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This article generally conforms to MoS guidelines. Where MoS guidelines allow differences between articles at editor discretion, this article uses the conventions listed here.

Copy editing

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These conventions do not apply to quotations or citation |title= parameters, which are left unchanged from the sources.

  1. Use American English, per the {{use American English}} template. A good American English dictionary is at https://www.merriam-webster.com/.
  2. Use "Month Day, Year" date format in prose, per the {{use mdy dates}} template.
  3. To prevent line breaks between month and day in prose, code for example April 12. Since content is often moved around, do this even if the date occurs very early on the line.
  4. To prevent line breaks within numerical quantities comprising two "words", code for example $10 billion.
  5. Use unspaced em dash ("—"), not spaced en dash (" – ").
  6. For em dash, code the HTML entity —. Do not code:
    • the actual em dash character (which is not found on standard keyboards and can be ambiguous in the font used in the edit window) or
    • the {{em dash}} template (which would unnecessarily consume some of the limited PEIS resource)
  7. For en dash, code the HTML entity –. Do not code:
    • the actual en dash character (which is not found on standard keyboards and can be ambiguous in the font used in the edit window) or
    • the {{en dash}} template (which would unnecessarily consume some of the limited PEIS resource)
  8. Use "U.S.", not "US", for abbreviation of "United States".
  9. Use the Oxford/serial comma. Write "this, that, and the other", not "this, that and the other".
  10. In the captions of images that depict Trump, generally omit identification of him; that is, omit his name. We omit the obvious, as image captions should always do. There are rare exceptions where "the obvious" is not so obvious, as at Donald Trump#Wealth (permalink).

References

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The Citation Style 1 (CS1) templates are used for most references, including all news sources. Most commonly used are {{cite news}}, {{cite magazine}}, {{cite book}}, and {{cite web}}.

  1. |work= and its aliases link to the Wikipedia article when one exists.
  2. Generally, |work= and its aliases match the Wikipedia article's title exactly when one exists. Code |work=[[The New York Times]], not |work=[[New York Times]]. Code |work=[[Los Angeles Times]], not |work=[[The Los Angeles Times]].
    • There are some exceptions where a redirect is more appropriate, such as AP News and NPR News, but be consistent with those exceptions.
    • When the article title includes a parenthetical, such as in Time (magazine), pipe the link to drop the parenthetical: |magazine=[[Time (magazine)|Time]]. Otherwise, there is rarely a good reason to pipe this link.
  3. Code |last= and |first= for credited authors, not |author=.
  4. Code |author-link= when an author has a Wikipedia article (known author links are listed below). Place this immediately after the |last= and |first= parameters for that author. |last1=Baker|first1=Peter|author-link1=Peter Baker (journalist)|last2=Freedman|first2=Dylan.
  5. In |title= parameters, all-caps "shouting" is converted to title case. "AP FACT CHECK:" becomes "AP Fact Check:".
  6. Per consensus 25, omit the archive-related parameters for sources that are not dead. These parameters are |url-status=, |archive-url=, and |archive-date=.
  7. Omit |language= for English-language sources.
  8. Omit |publisher= for news sources.
  9. Omit |location= for news sources.
  10. Omit |issn= for news sources.
  11. Code a space before the pipe character for each parameter. For example, code: |date=April 12, 2025 |last=Baker |first=Peter |author-link=Peter Baker (journalist)—not: |date=April 12, 2025|last=Baker|first=Peter|author-link=Peter Baker (journalist). This provides the following benefits for the edit window and diffs:
    • Improved readability.
    • Over all, this tends to allow more line breaks at logical places (between cite parameters).
  12. Otherwise, coding differences that do not affect what readers see are unimportant. Since they are unimportant, we don't need to revert changes by editors who think they are important (the changes, not the editors:). For example:
    • Any supported date format is acceptable since the templates convert dates to mdy format for display.
    • For web-based news sources, the choice between |work=, |newspaper=, and |website= is unimportant.
    • The sequence of template parameters is unimportant.

Tracking lead size

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Word counts by paragraph and total. Click [show] to see weeklies.

6 Jan 2026 :: 537 = 40 + 108 + 145 + 81 + 72 + 91

13 Jan 2026 :: 537 = 40 + 108 + 145 + 81 + 72 + 91

20 Jan 2026 :: 537 = 40 + 108 + 145 + 80 + 73 + 91

27 Jan 2026 :: 533 = 40 + 108 + 145 + 80 + 69 + 91

3 Feb 2026 :: 532 = 40 + 113 + 142 + 80 + 69 + 88

10 Feb 2026 :: 526 = 40 + 107 + 142 + 80 + 69 + 88

17 Feb 2026 :: 523 = 40 + 107 + 139 + 80 + 69 + 88

24 Feb 2026 :: 523 = 40 + 107 + 139 + 80 + 69 + 88

3 Mar 2026 :: 579 = 40 + 107 + 139 + 80 + 125 + 88

10 Mar 2026 :: 569 = 40 + 107 + 139 + 80 + 115 + 88

17 Mar 2026 :: 569 = 40 + 107 + 139 + 80 + 115 + 88

24 Mar 2026 :: 567 = 40 + 107 + 139 + 80 + 113 + 88

31 Mar 2026 :: 569 = 40 + 107 + 141 + 80 + 113 + 88

7 Apr 2026 :: 570 = 40 + 107 + 141 + 81 + 113 + 88

14 Apr 2026 :: 570 = 40 + 107 + 141 + 81 + 113 + 88

21 Apr 2026 :: 571 = 40 + 107 + 141 + 81 + 113 + 89

28 Apr 2026 :: 568 = 40 + 107 + 138 + 81 + 113 + 89

5 May 2026 :: 576 = 40 + 107 + 138 + 88 + 114 + 89

12 May 2026 :: 583 = 40 + 107 + 138 + 96 + 114 + 88

19 May 2026 :: 581 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 89 + 114 + 88

26 May 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 88 + 114 + 88

2 Jun 2026 :: 578 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 88

9 Jun 2026 :: 578 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 88

16 Jun 2026 :: 578 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 88

23 Jun 2026 :: 579 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 88 + 113 + 88

30 Jun 2026 :: 578 = 40 + 107 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 88

7 Jul 2026 :: 579 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 88

14 Jul 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 89

21 Jul 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 89

28 Jul 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 89

4 Aug 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 89

11 Aug 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 89

18 Aug 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 108 + 143 + 88 + 112 + 89

25 Aug 2026 :: 580 = 40 + 107 + 144 + 88 + 112 + 89

1 Sep 2026 :: 581 = 40 + 108 + 144 + 88 + 112 + 89

8 Sep 2026 :: 581 = 40 + 108 + 144 + 88 + 112 + 89

15 Sep 2026 :: 581 = 40 + 108 + 144 + 88 + 112 + 89

22 Sep 2026 :: 581 = 40 + 108 + 144 + 88 + 112 + 89

Tracking article size

[edit]

Readable prose size in words – Wiki markup size in bytes – Approximate number of additional citations before exceeding the PEIS limit.[a] Click [show] to see weeklies.

6 Jan 2026 :: 11,238 – 335,167 – 169

13 Jan 2026 :: 11,349 – 341,400 – 154

20 Jan 2026 :: 11,449 – 346,888 – 140

27 Jan 2026 :: 10,973 – 337,423 – 158

3 Feb 2026 :: 10,962 – 338,910 – 154

10 Feb 2026 :: 11,102 – 342,743 – 146

17 Feb 2026 :: 11,099 – 342,763 – 143

24 Feb 2026 :: 11,150 – 348,613 – 131

3 Mar 2026 :: 11,278 – 350,923 – 131

10 Mar 2026 :: 11,252 – 350,370 – 131

17 Mar 2026 :: 11,270 – 350,813 – 130

24 Mar 2026 :: 11,340 – 351,753 – 128

31 Mar 2026 :: 11,340 – 351,831 – 128

7 Apr 2026 :: 11,417 – 353,945 – 125

14 Apr 2026 :: 11,409 – 354,642 – 122

21 Apr 2026 :: 11,415 – 354,612 – 122

28 Apr 2026 :: 11,490 – 357,727 – 118

5 May 2026 :: 11,557 – 358,922 – 116

12 May 2026 :: 11,563 – 359,791 – 112

19 May 2026 :: 11,595 – 361,335 – 108

26 May 2026 :: 11,624 – 362,112 – 106

2 Jun 2026 :: 11,622 – 361,654 – 107

9 Jun 2026 :: 11,613 – 362,507 – 106

16 Jun 2026 :: 11,676 – 363,146 – 28 [discussion]

23 Jun 2026 :: 11,675 – 362,936 – 107

30 Jun 2026 :: 11,666 – 363,409 – 113

7 Jul 2026 :: 11,667 – 363,418 – 111

14 Jul 2026 :: 11,695 – 364,430 – 111

21 Jul 2026 :: 11,705 – 365,013 – 108

28 Jul 2026 :: 11,705 – 365,017 – 108

4 Aug 2026 :: 11,780 – 366,096 – 100

11 Aug 2026 :: 11,885 – 368,343 – 94

18 Aug 2026 :: 11,884 – 368,335 – 94

25 Aug 2026 :: 11,910 – 370,219 – 89

1 Sep 2026 :: 11,908 – 370,169 – 81

8 Sep 2026 :: 11,991 – 371,288 – 61

15 Sep 2026 :: 11,991 – 371,337 – 60

22 Sep 2026 :: 11,984 – 369,796 – 64

Categories, first attempt at weeding over-categorization

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Latest comment: 6 days ago12 comments5 people in discussion

I removed the following categories with the edit summary "Categories says that 'restraint should be exercised, as categories become less effective when an article is given numerous categories". Rmv categories that are not "central to categorizing the article.'"

I didn't remove Category:American business writers, never mind that Trump didn't write any of the books himself and they're mostly fiction but meh.

Except for #12, Businesspeople from Florida, all were reinserted in this edit with the edit summary "Restraint should be exercised" mostly refers to the fact that an article should not be included both into a category and its subcategory. This doesn't apply to most of those. This is an opinion not supported by the guideline. IMO, the paragraph following the one-sentence paragraph I quoted in my edit summary deals with a different point or idea.

Does the third bullet point of WP:CATDEF apply to the above categories? Quote: Defining characteristics of an article's topic are central to categorizing the article. A defining characteristic is one that reliable sources commonly and consistently refer to[2] in describing the topic, such as the nationality of a person or the geographic location of a place. Example: 20th-century Presbyterians, 21st-century Presbyterians, Presbyterians from New York (state), Presbyterians from New York (state), Former Presbyterians. That's a lot of Presbyterianism for someone who can't cite a single Bible verse and attended a Reformed church because of Norman Vincent Peale. See also WP:NONDEF: if the characteristic would not be appropriate to mention in the lead section of an article (regardless of whether it is currently mentioned in the lead), it is probably not defining. Space4TCatHerder🖖 20:43, 30 September 2026 (UTC)Reply

You are wasting your time. I doubt that this article's major problem is overcategorization. The main problem is that the article has way too much content, instead of relegating most of the details to sub-articles. Dimadick (talk) 20:52, 30 September 2026 (UTC)Reply
"The main problem is that the article has way too much content...". ErnestKrause (talk) 00:30, 1 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
A quick clarification, but as stated in prior conversations, this article is actually much smaller than several other pages about American presidents. BootsED (talk) 01:29, 2 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

Hi Dimadick; When you mentioned above "that the article has way too much content", could you draw attention to the 2-3 areas in the article which you feel your comment most applies to? Could you mention if further trimming of those sections might help, or, if they might be split and merged into other sibling articles? ErnestKrause (talk) 13:08, 5 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

Multiple paragraphs devoted to Donald's business and legal affairs, which already have several spin-off articles of their own. Overly-long descriptions of his presidencies, when there are more detailed articles on both presidencies. Overly-long descriptions of his political statements and habitual lies, which again have more detailed articles of their own. It seems like Wikipedia is rying to summarize or copy the contents of over a dozen different articles in Trump's main article. I don't see why this article has to be that detailed, or why there is so much duplication of contents. Dimadick (talk) 13:30, 5 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
This is a discussion about overcategorization/removing non-defining categories. Please, don't turn it into another discussion about whether and, if so, which part(s) of the article need to/should be trimmed. We've had plenty of those, the last long one six months ago. We don't have any control over articles that have been spun off from this — the original — one. That doesn't mean this article should be reduced to a list of wikilinks to other articles, IMO. Space4TCatHerder🖖 14:35, 5 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
Do either of you have an opinion about my proposed removal of non-defining categories? Space4TCatHerder🖖 14:35, 5 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
Dimadick appears to have the opinion that the categorization question may be a distraction from more driving issues like 'too much content'. I'm sort of interested to hear what Dimadick might identify by name as the top 2-3 subsection titles in the article deserving the most attention at this time; he seems to have some good thoughts about this issue of 'too much content'. ErnestKrause (talk) 21:32, 5 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
The question is, what constitutes "non-defining", and what is the exact criterion? That an article should not be included in both a category and subcategory is clear enough, so I did not reinstate Category:Businesspeople from Florida because the article is already in Category:Businesspeople from Palm Beach, Florida. But why shouldn't Trump be in Category:1946 births if he was born in 1946 or Category:American people of German descent? --HPfan4 (talk) 08:34, 6 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
Non-defining characteristics per WP:NONDEF:
So, do reliable secondary sources commonly and consistently define Trump, in prose, as being a Presbyterian, having been born in 1946, being of German descent, being a business person from Florida or Palm Beach, a non-fiction writer or a business writer (never mind the century), etc.? Billionaires, People from Palm Beach, Florida — check and check; television producers from Queens — nope. Space4TCatHerder🖖 14:17, 6 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

I'm not sure how to interpret the outcome of this discussion. HPfan4, do you still object to the removal of the categories? Space4TCatHerder🖖 13:24, 14 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

format suggestion: abbreviated list of assassination attempts

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Latest comment: 13 days ago2 comments2 people in discussion

The articles should feature a shorten list of assassination attempt against Donald Trump, mainly the big three assassination attempts 1). The 2024 Assassination attempt in Butler, Pennsylvania 2). Assassination attempt in West Palm Beach, Florida 3). White House Correspondents' Dinner shooting. As well I think it prudent to link the wiki article list of DJT security incidences ~2026-50050-52 (talk) 09:19, 7 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

Why? WP already has lists of attempts on and threats against U.S. presidents (see List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots#Former presidents wounded and List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots#Other attacks, assassination attempts, and plots) as well as Security incidents involving Donald Trump. Space4TCatHerder🖖 13:25, 7 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

When will it be facism?

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Latest comment: 5 days ago9 comments6 people in discussion

IMHO his policies seem accelerationist towards facism when I look at its traits.

There is media discourse that equates present day MAGA to facism. But that might not be the consensus of society.

Not naming the bad thing by its actual name might make Wikipedia normalize facism during it’s rise in US society.

Maybe referring to his place in the political lexicon might allow readers come away with more understanding of the societal context?

Idk, these were my feelings as a reader. Consider or ignore it as someone, like the Wikipedians that’ll read this, who know about these things much better. ~2026-48862-70 (talk) 15:59, 14 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

Right now there is no consensus; Trump is a fascist, so untill there is we cannot say it. Slatersteven (talk) 16:02, 14 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
There will never be. Consider the pols two years of drama ago:
“Responding to one of the more incendiary salvos, 49% of registered voters in the national survey say Trump is a fascist, defined as "a political extremist who seeks to act as a dictator, disregards individual rights and threatens or uses force against their opponents." Fewer than half as many, 22%, see Harris as a fascist by this definition.”
‘Perceptions of fascism are tied to partisanship: 87% of Democrats call Trump a fascist, compared with 46% of independents and 12% of Republicans. Harris, for her part, is seen as a fascist by 41% of Republicans, 20% of independents and 3% of Democrats.”
https://abcnews.com/Politics/donald-trump-fascist-concerns-poll/story?id=115083795
Perception varies, ofc ~2026-48862-70 (talk) 20:58, 15 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
We are not here to WP:RGW. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:39, 14 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
Idk, it’s a specific context described on:
Wikipedia:We are absolutely here to right great wrongs ~2026-48862-70 (talk) 21:02, 15 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
  • When the sources agree that it's fascism. There's unlikely to be sufficient agreement to put it in the article voice any time soon, so a more productive thing to focus on is whether there's enough coverage (and whether that debate is a significant enough part of his biography in the best available sources) for us to discuss it with cautious attribution. I think there probably is - notably, right now, the only thing that we say about fascism in the article is that Trump has called his political opponents fascists, which seems absurd given the relative weight of the discussions involved. What I would do is go over Donald Trump and fascism, determine the best sources, then consider a sentence or two here that can eventually be expanded into brief WP:SUMMARYSTYLE coverage of that article. The logical place to put it would be in the rhetoric, behavior, and political practice section. --Aquillion (talk) 18:33, 14 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
  • The subject of productive criticism of Trump and non-productive criticism of Trump seems a contentious topic in and of itself. Ambiguous indictments of Trump associated with various terms such as 'fascist', 'plutocratic', and 'nepotism' seems to many to be exercises in rhetoric and not directly encyclopedic. For example, applicable areas for Trump criticism in an encyclopedia might be better formulated along the lines of the very long list of legal disputations initiated against him and those he has initiated against others. Let the record of law court outcomes guide the discussion of productive criticism of him and his presidency, and not journalistic happenstance. ErnestKrause (talk) 09:17, 15 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
  • Quoting two Aussie scholars: "Despite the massive literature on fascism there is no widely agreed definition. What is agreed is that fascism is among the most mutable and syncretic of all political phenomena (Paxton Citation2004, 20)." The 2024 presidential election section does mention that Trump's rhetoric has been "described by some historians and scholars as authoritarian, fascist, and unlike anything a political candidate has ever said in American history":
It could be moved to the Rhetoric, behavior, and political practice section which mentions the 2016 campaign but not the one in 2024. I haven't looked for sources on rhetoric "described as fascist" during the second term. Are there any sources as yet for Trump's place in the political lexicon? Space4TCatHerder🖖 13:37, 15 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
NYC mayor Zohran Mamdani even said so: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/nov/23/mamdani-trump-fascist
Trump meets definition of a fascist, his former chief of staff says (https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-prefers-dictator-approach-former-chief-staff-says-2024-10-23/)
Regarding the place in the political lexicon, is this even about democracy anymore? Aside from breaking it? ~2026-48862-70 (talk) 21:27, 15 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

Controversial Page

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Latest comment: 2 days ago2 comments2 people in discussion

Admins should probably lock the page and its talk page to only trusted members ~2026-55749-17 (talk) 20:38, 18 October 2026 (UTC)Reply

It already is. That's why you can't edit it. Zaathras (talk) 02:08, 19 October 2026 (UTC)Reply
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